Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 6:15 pm Posts: 29996 Location: The District
MarkJohnson>You wrote:
chinabox wrote:
Isn't the reason that you risk it because other teams are putting together their rosters and won't really have any room on their various rosters to pick up a guy who is fringey on the Mets roster? Isn't this the best time to make a choice like this? We're all assuming that the Mets are positive that Rottino and Herrera are terrible, but the risk is that you deal with waivers when other teams are happy with their rosters and also get the benefit of whatever Herrera et al can give you.
Well, sure I guess the idea would be that now is better than a time you identify where 40 man rosters are ripe for external plucking (I guess that would be the offseason?), but that assumes a certain amount of inevitability to the moves, no? If there is an option to not have to make the moves at all, then isn't that the better one? But isn't now one of the times where there is more 40 man movement than, say, in-season? Aren't we probably scouring the waiver wire to see if there's anyone we like over Mike Baxter as a LH-OFer? Didn't Sandy say yesterday he wasn't comfortable with our bench? Don't you think there are other teams out there thinking the same thing?
I think another thing lost in this is the attractiveness of 40 man guys who have OPTIONS. We think of times where Nick Evans or Pat Misch or Nelson Figueroa cleared despite us freaking out over the possibility, and a big reason why was they were out of options, and teams weren't necessarily ready carry those guys on a 25man roster. But stashing someone on a 40 man and optioning them is a whole different thing altogether. This is how we grabbed Acosta a few years ago, despite there not being an immediate big league need. Just grab a guy for depth and option him.
And the real issue here isn't that, say, a move for Baxter is needed. Its that they are apparently discussing making moves for guys like Vin Rottino and Daniel Herrera, who would be needed for, apparently, something like 3-5 games. And in Herrera's case, he's being chosen not because they believe him to be the best candidate to fill in, but because they apparently believe him to be the most "disposable". Just seems odd to me. Vin Rottino certainly hasn't opened anybody's eyes, and if its down to the wire whether Torres is ready or not, how much playing time are you really carrying Rottino for?? Josh Satin couldn't give you the same value in the, maybe, 5 ABs if Torres misses 15 days?
I dunno, just seems odd. I guess trust that the FO knows what its doing, but they obviously deemed a lot of the guys they would now cut to be more valuable than Dan Herrera and Mike Baxter just a few weeks/months ago when they cut those 2 guys from the 40 man roster instead of the others - so when were they wrong? Then or now? For our sake, hopefully then.
I actually do agree with you, but I also operate under the assumption that the Mets front office -- in situations like these -- understand a lot more about the players/rules/market than I do. There are FO's all over the place that make poor decisions with regards to roster management, but there is always a rational basis for making decisions that don't seem to "make any sense."
Your point about other teams looking for talent on the waiver wire because that's what the Mets are doing is enveloped in a bit of irony. The reason the Mets are looking for talent is because their team is terrible. Other teams are looking, but I doubt the resources on the Flushing Forty-Man are what they're hoping hit waivers. So yeah, eyes and ears are open all over the league, but don't know how many waivable players we should be concerned would get nabbed at this point.
That said, can't imagine you'll be reading this thread in 3 years and saying, "See! Josh Satin just hit 40 HR's for the Blue Jays and we gave him up for a week of Herrera!"
_________________ I LIKE THE METS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"Well, this year I'm told the team did well because one pitcher had a fine curve ball. I understand that a curve ball is thrown with a deliberate attempt to deceive. Surely this is not an ability we should want to foster at Harvard." -Charles Eliot
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 2:57 pm Posts: 57804 Location: New York, NY
China, I pretty much agree with you in that none of the projected "losses" have much of a shot in coming back to haunt us. I'm as hard on the FO as it gets but so far they haven't lost anyone who has come back to haunt us. It's early but it's unlikely a Nick Evans or Fernando haunts us in the future. On the flip side... I'm not sure I understand the value of going with a Vinnie Rottino over throwing Satin or Lutz out there and hoping for the best. At least with those 2 there is SOME chance they can be valuable bench players for cheap for more than 1 year. Rottino is a bad baseball player, is old and has been awful all spring in the OF.
_________________ Twit-@Wexlerrules http://stlucietoflushing.com/ W.L.W- We Love Wheeler NYFS Top 30 list... starting 10/1 Staunch anti-BADP (Batting average dependent players) Pronounced "Dar-No"
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 6:15 pm Posts: 29996 Location: The District
Metro2007 wrote:
China, I pretty much agree with you in that none of the projected "losses" have much of a shot in coming back to haunt us. I'm as hard on the FO as it gets but so far they haven't lost anyone who has come back to haunt us. It's early but it's unlikely a Nick Evans or Fernando haunts us in the future. On the flip side... I'm not sure I understand the value of going with a Vinnie Rottino over throwing Satin or Lutz out there and hoping for the best. At least with those 2 there is SOME chance they can be valuable bench players for cheap for more than 1 year. Rottino is a bad baseball player, is old and has been awful all spring in the OF.
Let me be clear: If it were up to me, I'd do whatever I could to refrain from sending possible functional guys through waivers for a guy like Rottino. We're going to have to see how this all shakes out, but I don't think you or I or MJ are actually arguing about anything. We all agree it's kind of crazy to take any risk for the luxury of watching Vinny Rottino PH 3 times.
Maybe we're we're all ignoring the obvious truth here: Sandy has a bias in favor of Italians.
_________________ I LIKE THE METS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"Well, this year I'm told the team did well because one pitcher had a fine curve ball. I understand that a curve ball is thrown with a deliberate attempt to deceive. Surely this is not an ability we should want to foster at Harvard." -Charles Eliot
Caught this in Martino's article. I guess it's not really anything new since Rubin has been saying it'll be Herrera for days with Edgin going to the upper-minors, but:
Quote:
Josh Edgin will not make the team, but a club official said that the lefty reliever “had opened a lot of eyes around here, and we could see him again.”
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 2:57 pm Posts: 57804 Location: New York, NY
nmigliore wrote:
Caught this in Martino's article. I guess it's not really anything new since Rubin has been saying it'll be Herrera for days with Edgin going to the upper-minors, but:
Quote:
Josh Edgin will not make the team, but a club official said that the lefty reliever “had opened a lot of eyes around here, and we could see him again.”
Edgin has been very impressive. He'll 100% be on this team by mid-season barring injury.
_________________ Twit-@Wexlerrules http://stlucietoflushing.com/ W.L.W- We Love Wheeler NYFS Top 30 list... starting 10/1 Staunch anti-BADP (Batting average dependent players) Pronounced "Dar-No"
Joined: Mon Sep 18, 2006 6:15 pm Posts: 29996 Location: The District
nmigliore wrote:
Batista makes the team!
#TBATROLLFAIL on the Mets part.
_________________ I LIKE THE METS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
"Well, this year I'm told the team did well because one pitcher had a fine curve ball. I understand that a curve ball is thrown with a deliberate attempt to deceive. Surely this is not an ability we should want to foster at Harvard." -Charles Eliot
Andy Martino @SurfingTheMets Reply Retweet Favorite · Open In case you're wondering y Herrera will be a Met for few days: Mets didn't think Josh Edgin would make it thru waivers when Byrdak returned
Considering there is no way an actual official would think this since its simply irrational and untrue, either Martino's sources in the org are nowhere near the top, or he's simply making stuff up now.
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