With the lineup they're running out there and Roy Halladay gone for 6 to 8 weeks (and who knows how long after that), they're not a very good team.

I'm kind of surprised we're not hearing and reading more of that.

What happened to us is now happening to them.

Karma is a Be-Yotch.

I think it's mostly because the rest of the NL East is so close that the Phillies slipping doesn't mean a whole lot outside of Philadelphia.

Kinda

We passed over the part with the 5 straight division titles.

Well, we had 1 straight.

That's okay, I think they're going to be infinitely more screwed long-term. Omar's bad money pales in comparison to Amaya's bad money. Howard looked like an albatross even before signing his extension and subsequent injury, Lee and Halladay are being paid for what they were earlier in their careers, Hamels is likely gone after this year, Utley's knee looks like its toast, and they've got a premium closer signed to premium money without really having the supporting cast to justify having him. I'm not saying it's the Mets division by any means, but I think the Phils time at the top is probably over for the foreseeable future.

One of the things that tends to get overlooked, I think, is that winning and losing is dynamic.

When teams like the Nats and Marlins, and even, frankly, the Mets, given the last few years, win more games, there's an equal number of losses that have to come from somewhere.

But my reason for the original post was watching the game last night, I was seeing a lineup that was nothing like what we're used to seeing from the Phils and they had a guy pitching who was a 1B/DH in the minors until last year.

But looking at that lineup, I had none of the fear they'd come back unless the Mets pitchers simply didn't have it on that night. It's a far cry from the sense they used to project that they'd battle you for all 27 outs.

To me, this was easy to predict coming into the season.

The Phillies lost some punch a year ago when Werth left. Utley has been a shell of himself for a while, and Howard tearing his achilles apart was the final piece. Their offense simply isn't good - at all. And when/if Howard and Utley come back, I highly doubt they'll be anywhere close to the level they were at a few years ago (Utley especially).

Even with the bad offense, it still appeared they may be able to slide in the Playoffs. However, that was contingent on their top 3 staying healthy. Now, with Halladay out for 6 to 8 weeks at least, their chances just took an enormous hit. Wasn't very hard to see this coming...they're the 2nd oldest team in baseball (Halladay is 35, Lee will be 34 in August, Utley is 33, Howard is 32).

Don't feel bad for them one bit.

And, yeah, they're gonna be saddled with albatross contracts for some time.

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=34753&hilit=Phall+of+the+Phillies

Just a year ahead of my time.

To reiterate: I think that Howard extension, unnecessary that it was,mis going to be historically bad.

Even so, given their injury situation, Halladay not pitching like Halladay (though we now know why,) and Lee not even having a win this year despite a 2.82 ERA and .96 WHIP, with all that they are over .500 and only 4 games out of first. The Halladay injury is definitely going to kill them though.

I'll take 5 straight division titles and a world series with whatever financial problems that brings any day of the week over our last 5 years.