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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 12:33 am 
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Metro2007 wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
Look at the praise one gets just for writing a positive review of a Met prospect...



Quoting Baseball America's 2014 handbook doesn't seem like an iffy way of forming a scouting report to you? Especially considering that came out BEFORE the 2014 season? Does John Sickels get away with "Baseball Prospectus loved Matz in their 2014 handbook"?


I'd say half the reports I see on the internet seem to be based on other people's work. At least this kid is educated enough to give proper attribution.


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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:26 am 
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acerimusdux wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
Look at the praise one gets just for writing a positive review of a Met prospect...



Quoting Baseball America's 2014 handbook doesn't seem like an iffy way of forming a scouting report to you? Especially considering that came out BEFORE the 2014 season? Does John Sickels get away with "Baseball Prospectus loved Matz in their 2014 handbook"?


I'd say half the reports I see on the internet seem to be based on other people's work. At least this kid is educated enough to give proper attribution.


I think the problem comes with when trying to take the work of others, applying some fairly generic talking points, and "projecting" a future outcome. I guess its the job of the reader to ascertain the level of expertness of the writer, but I still feel like its misleading to run some sort of scouting blog or minor league roundup thing based solely on others' work and just apply your own prediction. That comes off extremely lazy and misleading to me. At that point, are you anything more than a random message board poster?

I guess it all would be based on what you hold yourself out to be.


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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:27 am 
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I don't know why we're worrying so much about some kid's resume builder.

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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:29 am 
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LTKfRGM wrote:
Cheech's last 38 games in St. Lucie: July 23-Aug 31:

.266 .364 .430 .793 - and a .793 OPS might not make you want to stand an applaud, but he did it with a .263 babip. 4 homers, 21 walks, just 14 Ks 154 PAs. That's a respectable finish.


Agreed. But I think we've dumbed down expectations for him based on his own less than star worthy start to his career. Lets not forget where this kid was drafted and what that should mean. Literally drafted next to Addison Russell and 6 spots ahead of Corey Seager.

I hope for Gavin's sake he continues to make progress. But there's already a sense of he can't possibly turn out as good as those 2 and we shouldn't even bother considering those outcomes, and that to me is an issue.


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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:31 am 
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northway wrote:
I don't know why we're worrying so much about some kid's resume builder.


That was more of a soap-box point than specific to this kid. The amount of sudden "experts" in the field of minor leagues and scouting when you have access to a BA subscription and a url bothers me a bit.


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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:49 am 
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northway wrote:
That teenager writes better than most sportswriters.



Most sports writers peak around age 15


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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 11:53 am 
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I have no disdain for the kid. I was just pointing out his opinion/review are a) From an young kid and not a "known" prospect person b) he's summarizing others work and forming an opinion. Not knocking him for it but like MJ said it's like me doing the same with Moncada and then somebody on a Yankees site citing my article as some sort of actual new information.

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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 12:14 pm 
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MarkJohnson>You wrote:
LTKfRGM wrote:
Cheech's last 38 games in St. Lucie: July 23-Aug 31:

.266 .364 .430 .793 - and a .793 OPS might not make you want to stand an applaud, but he did it with a .263 babip. 4 homers, 21 walks, just 14 Ks 154 PAs. That's a respectable finish.


Agreed. But I think we've dumbed down expectations for him based on his own less than star worthy start to his career. Lets not forget where this kid was drafted and what that should mean. Literally drafted next to Addison Russell and 6 spots ahead of Corey Seager.



What is to this point the single biggest blunder made by this FO since they've been here and gets little attention. Yes yes, other teams passed on Seager, but that's always an easy out. I'm not condemning them for passing on Giolito due to injury or Wacha or Fernandez the yr before like some others have done, but Seager will never go away for me. Sure, he's only played 38 games in AA so far but he's pretty much a consensus top 10 prospect at not even 21 yet. That was a monster miss and the sort of high ceiling position player they just don't have.

Yeah I don't want to be a buzzkill coming on the heels of all the kudos our farm system has received recently, but of the players most often cited as our top prospects, there just isn't much immediate impact coming and/or some there is a blocking issue that needs resolving:

Noah - spot needs to be opened
Matz - unless he goes into the pen, it's another spot that needs clearing
Plaw - blocked
Rosario - yrs away
Herrera - probably the closest to having an impact certainly of the position players, but he's ultimately slated to replace a player of more or less similar impact = wash tho cheaper
Nimmo - prob mid 2016 at the earliest.
Conforto - ditto Nimmo
Molina - yrs away

So probably the most exciting of the young position players may be Rosario, he's yrs away from reaching the MLs. Herrera replacing Murphy is probably more or less a wash, tho a clear positive from a payroll standpoint. Plawecki will have minimum impact as long as TDA is here. Nimmo and Conforto probably wind up the OF corners if all goes according to plan but I wouldn't expect that to take full effect until 2017 frankly while Grandy and Cuddy are here.

And unless spots are opened up in the rotation, which requires the FO to actually do stuff, guys like Noah, Matz and Monty are going to struggle for opportunities.

Seager otoh, would be on a direct path to making a huge impact.


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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 12:48 pm 
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This not intended as a shot at Baseball Prospectus, because I respect what they do.

But is there a huge difference between a group of baseball fans with deep understanding of generic statistical analysis starting BP and what this kid is doing?

Or even Bill James starting the way he did?

Anyone with a computer and internet access can become a "published" writer.

And as others have noted, this kid is both a good writer and someone with the integrity to credit sources he borrows from.

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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 1:05 pm 
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Chico wrote:
This not intended as a shot at Baseball Prospectus, because I respect what they do.

But is there a huge difference between a group of baseball fans with deep understanding of generic statistical analysis starting BP and what this kid is doing?

Or even Bill James starting the way he did?

Anyone with a computer and internet access can become a "published" writer.

And as others have noted, this kid is both a good writer and someone with the integrity to credit sources he borrows from.



Chico,
You don't think it's worth knowing the "credentials" and age of the person writing the piece? I'd like to know if this is someone like Keith Law or McDaniel with actual scouting credentials or a blogger. This is in fact a random blogger. That's not a knock on the kid just the facts.

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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 2:20 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Chico wrote:
This not intended as a shot at Baseball Prospectus, because I respect what they do.

But is there a huge difference between a group of baseball fans with deep understanding of generic statistical analysis starting BP and what this kid is doing?

Or even Bill James starting the way he did?

Anyone with a computer and internet access can become a "published" writer.

And as others have noted, this kid is both a good writer and someone with the integrity to credit sources he borrows from.



Chico,
You don't think it's worth knowing the "credentials" and age of the person writing the piece? I'd like to know if this is someone like Keith Law or McDaniel with actual scouting credentials or a blogger. This is in fact a random blogger. That's not a knock on the kid just the facts.


I don't take issue with that at all.

In fact, I was pretty dismissive of that "expert" who surfaced last year with all the opinions on Matt Harvey and all I could find on the guy was a self-published blog and some (apparently) self-produced DVDs.

And that doesn't even mean that people who self-publish aren't capable of producing worthwhile stuff.

I was just making the point that some people who have reached the level of "respected" or "established" don't necessarily have what I'd call impeccable credentials.

For example. Mel Kiper, Jr., as far as I know, never coached or scouted where his evaluations made the difference between a team winning and losing games and people like coaches and GMs losing their jobs.

I think that was a big thing behind his spat with Bill Polian.

That said, Kiper wouldn't have lasted this long if he wasn't good at what he does.

I guess all I'm really saying is that I take a lot them with a grain of salt, whether they're a 15-year old blogger or a writer for Baseball America.

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 Post subject: Re: Cecchini write up
PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2015 4:08 pm 
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Kiper is totally self-made and created a market for himself. Major props despite the hair lol

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