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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:28 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
Wow tough crowd. Guess you didn't catch any of the games in SD. Spang looked pretty special defensively and he's got 4 or 5 control years to go and hits LHed. But the C and LHed arm in that deal can be pretty special. Either way I see them going outside the org to fill 3B.

Anything on ACab possibly to the DBs? They suddenly look very thin on the IF.



Special? Numbers say he's horrid at 3b. What am I missing? Again -5 DRS in only 59 games. That's the opposite of special. He's also hitting .272 despite a .355 BABIP. 6% walk rate, 27% k rate.

we'll have to agree to disagree. Flo is not in the same stratosphere with Spang defensively. I don't want Flo anywhere near anything but a 1Bmen's mitt and we'll cover this ground all winter I suspect.

This is also Spang's first shot at playing regularly. He's also a former 1st rd pick and still just 26. There's every reason to believe there's still some runway to go with him. Lot of potential value untapped still pre-Arb.


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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:29 pm 
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And for those "doubting" DRS here are your top 10 in baseball Betts, Buxton, Simmons, Russell, Arenado, Pillar, Iglesias, Gordon, Gyorko, Ozuna

Top 5 at 3B Arenado, Gyorko, Longoria, Machado, Suarez

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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:32 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Not trying to be snarky but I JUST posted he has posted a -5 DRS over 59 games at 3B. Wilmer -5 DRS in 41 games at 3b so while we all agree Wilmer is a poor defender at 3b how is Spangenberg "pretty special" at 3b with an identical -5 DRS?

Right but I also just posted that must not have seen any of the games we played in SD 2 weeks ago. I really don't care what the metrics say for Spang st this juncture.


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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:33 pm 
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All due respect the gap between "pretty special" and what the numbers say is immense. Could he improve? Of course. But the numbers really don't like him so far. I fully acknowledge Flores isn't a good defensive player. That makes my point.

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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:34 pm 
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HeyNowHK wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
Not trying to be snarky but I JUST posted he has posted a -5 DRS over 59 games at 3B. Wilmer -5 DRS in 41 games at 3b so while we all agree Wilmer is a poor defender at 3b how is Spangenberg "pretty special" at 3b with an identical -5 DRS?

Right but I also just posted that must not have seen any of the games we played in SD 2 weeks ago. I really don't care what the metrics say for Spang st this juncture.



Any player can make nice plays over 1 series. Any player in baseball and that includes Wilmer Flores.

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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:39 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
Not trying to be snarky but I JUST posted he has posted a -5 DRS over 59 games at 3B. Wilmer -5 DRS in 41 games at 3b so while we all agree Wilmer is a poor defender at 3b how is Spangenberg "pretty special" at 3b with an identical -5 DRS?

Right but I also just posted that must not have seen any of the games we played in SD 2 weeks ago. I really don't care what the metrics say for Spang st this juncture.



Any player can make nice plays over 1 series. Any player in baseball and that includes Wilmer Flores.

Really? When has Wilmer ever looked viable at 3B? Suffice it to say I don't agree with the Wilmer assessment.


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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:49 pm 
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So you are willing to throw out a 59 game sample size where a player grades poorly vs. a 3 game sample size where he impressed you to the point you believe he's "special" at 3b? Doesn't that seem a little odd?

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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:55 pm 
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Steve The Original wrote:
MetsWhiz93 wrote:
How much is Yu Darvish getting in free agency?


Real interesting case. I think a lot is going to be determined by how he pitches the rest of the year. He's a health risk, his ERA has continued to rise over the past few years, and his K rate while still excellent has dropped as well. If he has a great rest of the year he's easily going to command $20 Mil per year. If he struggles maybe not so much.


I was thinking Darvish might be a good (unexpected) sign by the mets. He's homer prone but Citi is a good park for a guy like that. I've read Texas wants to bring him back and I have a tough time seeing us outbid them.

Dream-off-season the Mets would sign Darvish, Lucroy, Bruce, Reed, Walker & maybe Nunez (and cut Cabrera), Trade Harvey, maybe try Matz in the Pen, Rotation, Thor, deGrom, Darvish, and the best 2 of Lugo, Gsellman & Wheeler, but . . . I'm just being silly. They won't spend half that much.

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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 1:57 pm 
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PS Yes I've seen Wilmer Flores make occasional "great" plays at 3b. Murphy "never" made a good play at 2b?

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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:04 pm 
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LTKfRGM wrote:
I was thinking Darvish might be a good (unexpected) sign by the mets. He's homer prone but Citi is a good park for a guy like that. I've read Texas wants to bring him back and I have a tough time seeing us outbid them.

Dream-off-season the Mets would sign Darvish, Lucroy, Bruce, Reed, Walker & maybe Nunez (and cut Cabrera), Trade Harvey, maybe try Matz in the Pen, Rotation, Thor, deGrom, Darvish, and the best 2 of Lugo, Gsellman & Wheeler, but . . . I'm just being silly. They won't spend half that much.



That's why I asked :lol: :lol: :lol:

The Mets thrive with good pitching, why not add a premium, frontline starter? Signing Darvish on like a four, five-year deal would be smart to go with Thor and deGrom. You worry about the rest later.


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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:05 pm 
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LTKfRGM wrote:
Is it just me, or does thinking about 2018 make everyone's head hurt a little.

Looking at the team - before any free agency oves

C: d'Arnaud/Plaw (Nido)
1B: Dom (Wilmer/TJ)
2B: Wilmer/TJ (Cecchini)
SS: Rosario
3B: Ascab (he's still here, isn't he, and he only costs 6.5 million after buyout)
OF: Cespedes, Conforto, Lagares (Nimmo)

Starters: Thor, deGrom, Matz, Wheeler, Harvey, Gsellman, Lugo
Pen Familia, Ramos, Blevins, Callahan, Smoker, etc.

Needs: An OF - especially with Cespedes' and Lagares heath issues. Bringing back Bruce might actually work. They have enough CF with Conforto/Lagares/Nimmo. Defense is a little weak for some lineups but not so bad that they need to sign another defensive wiz (Juan - stay heathy for a change).

Infield - Rosario is young, Dom is young, Wilmer & TJ & Ascab are maybe not guys you want starting - and that's all 4 projected positions covered by those 5 questions. Beefing up the infield is essential. Moustakas might be the guy, but . . . I'm not sold on him. Frazier is OK but he's a .220 hitter now. Trade? (The guy on the Reds is great but I wouldn't trade him if I was Cincy, not yet anyway.)

I keep coming back to Walker - he'll cost maybe half what Moustakas might get and povide solid numbers. If he gets hurt, we have guys like Wilmer & TJ who can fill in, so signing the injury prone player who' expressed interest in staying, that might not be the dumbest move vs overpaying.

Nunez is possible. I don't think he's an ideal starter either but he can play OF and infield - which brings flexibility.

But I've just spend 30 million on basically putting the same team together that we've had for the last two years. That makes me want to bang my head against a wall. I just don't see it. I don't see how, on their budget, that they can build the team I'd like to see next year. Free agency is too expensive and they don't have enough in the minors.

Maybe they can trade Harvey for . . . I don't know. If all 7 of our starters are healthy in Spring Training . . . a trade - maybe.

Some people might want to trade Wilmer cause TJ can replace him, but I don't think we'll get that much for Wilmer, and he provides depth and insurance at 1st if Dom struggles. I wouldn't trade Wilmer.

I don't see the right move that I think will or could happen.

Bangs head against wall some more. I don't see it. They're good, but I don't know if they're good enough.


It's basically all going to come down to three things, IMO:

1) Youth - the development and how quickly Rosario and Smith make the transition. Not to mention whether or not one of TdA or Plawecki can make themselves an average MLBer, if you still consider them "youth". Also keep an eye on Conforto. This year was a big step in the right direction, but there is still potential for more. Next year he can really cement himself as an elite hitter in this league, which will obviously be a big boost for the team.

2) Health - obviously the main pieces are the starting pitchers. Not just their health but how effective they are when healthy. Harvey, in particular. We appear to know what we have with deGrom and Syndergaard when they're on the field. IMO we need one more "front of the rotation" guy to really be considered a contending team. Harvey is still the best bet for that. I suppose you can throw Wright into this discussion as well, but only if they choose not to bring in a long-term 3B because of him.

...and

3) The Bullpen - they stockpiled a bunch of arms. Some close to MLB ready and some not so close. Those guys PLUS the guys that they currently have who are trying to establish themselves(Sewald, Robles, Smoker, Montero, etc) will hopefully be enough **** to throw at the wall to get something to stick. Even with that though, they still need to spend on a quality arm, even after bringing in Ramos. McGee would be my preference, but someone has to be brought in. A team built on starting pitching needs to have a bullpen to match.

SO...is this a lot to ask for/expect? Probably. Is it possible? I'd say it's possible, but more than likely we'll only get one of the three; maybe two if we're lucky. That's with no one brought in aside from a late-inning reliever. I'm sure money will be spent in other areas, I'm just hoping that it's nothing that we'll be regretting in a year or two.


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 Post subject: Re: 2018 lineup?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2017 2:31 pm 
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What would it take to get Suarez from the Reds? He's solid and controllable for a while. I imagine it would take a couple very good minor leaguers.


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