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?
Poll ended at Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:59 am
Phil Evans (Util) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Mark Vientos (SS/3B) 54%  54%  [ 13 ]
Anthony Kay (LHP) 4%  4%  [ 1 ]
Chris Flexen (RHP) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Tomas Nido (C) 8%  8%  [ 2 ]
Peter Alonso (1b) 25%  25%  [ 6 ]
Justin Dunn (RHP) 4%  4%  [ 1 ]
Thomas Szapucki (LHP) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Desmond Lindsay (OF) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Luis Guillorme (SS) 4%  4%  [ 1 ]
Total votes : 24
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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:52 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Vientos had a verbal agreement with the Braves at 41. If he went a few picks later than first round I’m not sure how that suggests some sort of “dropped stock”.

And how many other guys had verbal agreements with the Braves at 41?


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:53 pm 
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Even as an underclassman, Vientos was well-known for the huge upside in his bat. Before transferring to American Heritage, Vientos participated in the 2016 National High School Invitational with Pembroke Pines, Fla.’s Flanagan High where he showed rare ability to impact the baseball. On the summer showcase circuit the following summer, Vientos consistently hit the ball hard and that hasn’t stopped this spring. At 6-foot-4 and 200 pounds, Vientos has a projectable body that should add even more strength. He has thunderous hands and he’s able to generate explosive bat speed without loading his hands deeply. He’s able to drive the ball with backspin to the gaps and he projects for at least plus power as he learns to loft the ball more. Defensively, Vientos is unlikely to stay at shortstop, lacking the glove actions or body control typically found at the position. He’s also a well below-average runner. His plus arm strength leads scouts to project him moving to third base or a corner outfield spot.Vientos is one of the youngest prospects in the class and won’t turn 18 until December. He is committed to Miami, but his loud offensive skillset and youth are likely to entice a team to pick him on the first day of the draft.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:54 pm 
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acerimusdux wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
Vientos had a verbal agreement with the Braves at 41. If he went a few picks later than first round I’m not sure how that suggests some sort of “dropped stock”.

And how many other guys had verbal agreements with the Braves at 41?



I couldn't tell you but he was told he was the pick before the draft started, then Kyle Wright fell and changed things.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 1:59 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
acerimusdux wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
Vientos had a verbal agreement with the Braves at 41. If he went a few picks later than first round I’m not sure how that suggests some sort of “dropped stock”.

And how many other guys had verbal agreements with the Braves at 41?



I couldn't tell you but he was told he was the pick before the draft started, then Kyle Wright fell and changed things.

Yeah, but that happens a lot.

I realize it's splitting hairs between late 1st round and 2nd round. But I guess at the top of these lists, you have to split some hairs.

And I think it's perfectly reasonable if someone has Vientos over Peterson. Just don't think it's that surprising that many people have it the other way.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:05 pm 
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I was really reacting more to Thompson vs. Vientos. I don't even have a particular strong argument for Vientos other than the "dream" upside is likely a middle of the lineup slugger whereas realistically Peterson's "dream" upside barring something unusual is a #3 SP. But the gap between ceiling/floor for both is massive so if you prefer a big lefty who did well in NCAA I can't really argue against you. I do think Vientos trade value would DWARF Thompson's and that's how I personally compare prospects head to head.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:12 pm 
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MLB.com (I assume Callis and Mayo) had him at #67 ahead of the draft:

Quote:
Scouting grades: Hit: 50 | Power: 50 | Run: 30 | Arm: 55 | Field: 50 | Overall: 45

Vientos entered the spring as one of the more intriguing high school bats in the country, one who many thought had first-round potential. An up-and-down spring has made him a bit more of a polarizing prospect than that, with opinions on him varying greatly.

Vientos' offensive potential is what had scouts interested in the first place, so if you saw him when he was swinging the bat well, you like him. He hasn't done that as consistently as some would have liked to see. He does show good bat speed and has definite power potential from the right side of the plate. Vientos isn't overly athletic, so even though he plays shortstop for his high school team at American Heritage, he will likely have to move to third at the next level, with some thinking he has the hands and arm strength to handle the hot corner.

Vientos did miss some time this spring with a quad injury, but he certainly has been seen enough over the summer and at events like the National High School Invitational. He reminds some of Manny Machado in terms of body type, and he's also drawn a Michael Morse in high school comp. A team believing his bat will play will give the Miami commit a shot in the opening few rounds.


If you buy the "45" grade, he doesn't belong in the top 3. And the inconsistency this spring is what I was talking about, why he wasn't quite a first round guy. But maybe he did perform well enough in the GCL to take the more optimistic view?

I'd just like to see some actual reports out of the GCL. I don't want to think people are ranking him up because they are scouting the stat line at that level. Statistical projection has some validity by the time you get to AA, but it's really tough to read much into GCL performance.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:14 pm 
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BA seemingly has done their lists "at random" and in no clear order (meaning when they reveal them, not the order of the prospects obviously)

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:15 pm 
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Grant (Queens, NY): As a Mets fan looking at a desolate system, please reassure me about David Peterson. First, would he have ranked in your top 5 and second, could he become an ace?

J.J. Cooper: You have reasons to be concerned. This is a pretty thin farm system right now. Peterson’s pro stat line right now is 3 outings, 3.2 innings so it’s not like many scouts/coaches saw him pitch. He would have ranked somewhere 5-10 on this list if he had thrown the 20+ more innings he needed to throw to qualify (assuming his stuff looked the same as it did in the 1 inning stints). He looks more like a solid starter rather than a front-line ace, but obviously a lot could change once he gets to work stints longer than 1 inning.


Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/2 ... Smu78dy.99

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:16 pm 
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Cooper also said JMM has some tools but needs refinement and that Trey Cobb "is funky" but that there wasn't a single Cyclone in discussion for top 20.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:18 pm 
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Both Mets questions had Cooper commenting how poor/thin the system is right now. Woohoo.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:20 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Grant (Queens, NY): As a Mets fan looking at a desolate system, please reassure me about David Peterson. First, would he have ranked in your top 5 and second, could he become an ace?

J.J. Cooper: You have reasons to be concerned. This is a pretty thin farm system right now. Peterson’s pro stat line right now is 3 outings, 3.2 innings so it’s not like many scouts/coaches saw him pitch. He would have ranked somewhere 5-10 on this list if he had thrown the 20+ more innings he needed to throw to qualify (assuming his stuff looked the same as it did in the 1 inning stints). He looks more like a solid starter rather than a front-line ace, but obviously a lot could change once he gets to work stints longer than 1 inning.


Read more at http://www.baseballamerica.com/minors/2 ... Smu78dy.99


That's actually kind of positive. They said his stuff looked good (5-10 range). That's not Molina good, same league a few years earlier cause Molina was #1 overall, but 5-10 is still good and they based it off his stuff not his college.


There's also this

Quote:
Peter (Brooklyn): Any Cyclones close to making the list? Peterson maybe? The cupboard looks bare for the Mets...

J.J. Cooper: Jose Miguel Medina has tools but needs refinement. Trey Cobb is funky. But no there was no one who was in top 20 consideration and overall the cupboard is somewhat bare.



Medina got some praise before, I guess he's toolsy but raw - that's what "needs refinement" means I think. I'm not sure what Funky is supposed to mean in this context. Weird delivery that fools some hitters?

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 2:24 pm 
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Not actually arguing for Thompson higher, just saying, here's Thompson per mlb.com:

Quote:
Scouting grades: Hit: 45 | Power: 55 | Run: 30 | Arm: 40 | Field: 45 | Overall: 45

Thompson used a huge junior season at Miami, where he was at or near the top of Division I leaders in home runs and RBIs, to move himself to the fourth round of the Draft. He was out of gas during his pro debut, but the Mets were pleased to see more of the real Thompson in 2016 when he led the organization in RBIs while playing across two levels of A-ball.

Thompson's calling cards in college were his considerable raw power and his approach at the plate, as he drew a ton of walks and didn't strike out that much, especially for a run producer. While his K rate has remained solid, his BB rate hasn't, although it did improve a tick following his promotion to the Florida State League. Continued refinement should lead to a better hit tool and Thompson tapping into that power more consistently. He really struggled at third during his pro debut, but the Mets saw improved defense from him during his first full year and feel that as he continues to work hard at it, he should be able to stay there.

Even if Thompson would have to move over to first, he might develop the bat to profile well offensively there. For now, though, he'll stick at the hot corner with an eye toward the upper levels of the system. He was not nearly as productive with the move up to Double-A early in 2017, however.


Even though they give both "45", Vientos clearly has better grades. Vientos's arm and defense are projected better. But they have the bats about the same, power/hit at 50/50 vs 45/55.

I just don't think we're talking here about a far off guy who looks like a future all-star, I think we're talking about a far off guy who has a chance to be solid. That's all I'm saying. Ceiling doesn't yet sound much better to me than these boring solid college guys.


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