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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:13 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Mets fans have an unusually "angry" attitude toward the sports writers that doesn't seem to exist within any other fanbases outside of Frank Isola. Not really sure what it is but I don't see Ranger, Yankee, Jet, Giant etc fans with as much anger/disdain for the writers (even when things are awful).


I don't really agree, I see no more antagonistic fan-writer atitude than Jet fans. Met fans mostly mock the beat guys (especially since Rubin left, all the rest suffer in comparison) but Jet fans actively loathe Mehta, Cimini, Serby, etc. And not without reason cause most are all too happy to play up the Same Old Jet narrative to sell contreversy and papers.


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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:34 pm 
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AllWrightNow wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
Mets fans have an unusually "angry" attitude toward the sports writers that doesn't seem to exist within any other fanbases outside of Frank Isola. Not really sure what it is but I don't see Ranger, Yankee, Jet, Giant etc fans with as much anger/disdain for the writers (even when things are awful).


I don't really agree, I see no more antagonistic fan-writer atitude than Jet fans. Met fans mostly mock the beat guys (especially since Rubin left, all the rest suffer in comparison) but Jet fans actively loathe Mehta, Cimini, Serby, etc. And not without reason cause most are all too happy to play up the Same Old Jet narrative to sell contreversy and papers.



People ROUTINELY called Adam Rubin a "troll", I mean it was almost a daily occurrence any season the Mets were "not good", Adam Rubin has one of the most vanilla personalities I've ever seen/heard yet he was a "troll" to many. Andy Martino? Forget about it. Bart Hubbuch used to get it non-stop as well. Now it's Carig's turn (Carig for his part does some to revel in poking the hive a bit but people should have thick enough skin on social media to recognize it). Guess we need a whipping boy? It's part of the reason people used to flock to Metsblog. He was so "pro-Mets" that many ate it up. Frank Isola is so openly anti-Knick in every possible way it plays as parody but people on here looking for their first chance to knock the writers doesn't surprise me in the least.

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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:37 pm 
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HeyNowHK wrote:
Is there really surprise there is animus toward Carig? The guy trashed Collins on his way out the door based on a bunch of unnamed sources... and as if the clubhouse of a 92 loss veteran purged team is going to be in perfect harmony. And on the heels of the team doing nothing to show Collins any gratitude on the way out the door as the season was winding down.

People with real cred such as Howie, Gary and David Wright rushed in to defend Collins. It's not like I am some big Collins fan but a story based on unnamed sources and "Collins didn't say hello to me" is not really worth much investment of energy IMO. Players being annoyed they didn't get enough playing time is one thing. Players should always be annoyed they are sitting for guys like Jose Reyes. But again, that has been discussed. Collins manages to win games, and you can't expect him to suppress that competitiveness. Breakdowns with the FO are something else, but they take two to tango. There is no evidence that any breakdown occurring between the dugout and the FO is the exclusive fault of the mgr.

As far as animus with other beat writers, I'm not really aware of much. I generally have a dim view of the whole lot but none really shakes me up much.


So the other writers chiming in after Carig's story were all wrong as well? Where were the other writers disputing these comments. David Wright might be a swell guy but he has "cred" in potentially knocking or confirming knocks on Terry Collins? Really? David Wright is the guy you go to for a vanilla quote or something nice to say about Collins on the way out the door not a critical analysis. Same with Gary Cohen, a company man. Was Jeff Paternostro lying or a company shill with he noted he had heard the same types of stories moments after Carig's piece came out?

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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:43 pm 
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Also no knock on David Wright but his quote regarding "snakes" may or may not be valid but his own personal experience with Collins really wasn't much of a defense in regard to the rest of the team. It's like Lebron James saying "Tyronn Lue treated me incredibly well, so there is no way it was different with other players".

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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:51 pm 
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Rubin was probably the only Met writer worth following over the past 2 decades but he must have burnt himself out working 20 hour days because he was nearly unbearable his last few years at ESPN.


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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:52 pm 
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Gary Cohen is a "company man"? Cohen is more critical/honest about the team he covers than probably any other professional sports broadcaster. That's the guy who's cred you are poking a hole in? And David Wright has been a Met longer than anyone else. You're saying he isn't one to vouch for the guy's character?

Again, it's not like cracks in the foundation are unheard of in the stretch run of a 92 loss season after purging a bunch of veterans. So where is the story in this? There was a little testiness in the clubhouse? Yeah, ok. So...?

But Carig turned it into a hatchet job against Collins. He made Collins look really bad which didn't seem necessary as a swan song. So again, I'm asking why is there surprise when some people were turned off by that?


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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:57 pm 
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HeyNowHK wrote:
Gary Cohen is a "company man"? Cohen is more critical/honest about the team he covers than probably any other professional sports broadcaster. That's the guy who's cred you are poking a hole in? And David Wright has been a Met longer than anyone else. You're saying he isn't one to vouch for the guy's character?

Again, it's not like cracks in the foundation are unheard of in the stretch run of a 92 loss season after purging a bunch of veterans. So where is the story in this? There was a little testiness in the clubhouse? Yeah, ok. So...?



Gary Cohen has mentioned spending and lack thereof? Has Gary Cohen EVER mentioned the Wilpons on air in anything other than a passing reference? If so I don't recall ever hearing one. Where were all of these players calling Carig a liar? David Wright didn't even call him one. He crapped on his own "snake" teammates and said HIS experience wasn't like that. In fact, if you really want to read into it Wright seemingly went out of his way to AVOID suggesting Carig was lying. Carig's snark/"negative" comments about the Mets are cover for his being a mouthpiece for the Mets as well? He's fed into from Jeff (an NYFS theory) so then he is snarky about them on twitter so people don't catch on? Bottom line, I 100% believe players spoke to Carig and gave him anti-Collins quotes/comments. I have zero doubt. Whether it was warranted, that's another story but not one that insinuates Carig fabricated said story.

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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:57 pm 
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HeyNowHK wrote:
G[b]ary Cohen is a "company man"? Cohen is more critical/honest about the team he covers than probably any other professional sports broadcaster.


Truth.


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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:59 pm 
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It's an insult to Gary Cohen to suggest he's rarely very critical of the FO or ownership? He critiques effort or even poor performance but he doesn't even critique in-game decisions unless they are egregious.

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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:00 pm 
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dragonfly wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
G[b]ary Cohen is a "company man"? Cohen is more critical/honest about the team he covers than probably any other professional sports broadcaster.


Truth.



Does Gary Cohen normally critique the Wilpons or Sandy Alderson, yes or no?

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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:03 pm 
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PS how did the beat writers know the name of EVERY candidate except Mark DeRosa if they were being played by the FO? I'm still trying to understand how this is the case. All but Mark DeRosa were openly known to be candidates. The writers guessing guys like Hale/Geren might be candidates somehow proves the FO "tricked" them? Really strange stuff/theories. Hiring Callaway was a surprise, Callaway being a candidate was OPENLY known by the writers since "day one" of the process.

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 Post subject: Re: Sherman: Mets to hire Callaway as manager
PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:04 pm 
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HeyNowHK wrote:
Gary Cohen is a "company man"? Cohen is more critical/honest about the team he covers than probably any other professional sports broadcaster. That's the guy who's cred you are poking a hole in? And David Wright has been a Met longer than anyone else. You're saying he isn't one to vouch for the guy's character?

Again, it's not like cracks in the foundation are unheard of in the stretch run of a 92 loss season after purging a bunch of veterans. So where is the story in this? There was a little testiness in the clubhouse? Yeah, ok. So...?

But Carig turned it into a hatchet job against Collins. He made Collins look really bad which didn't seem necessary as a swan song. So again, I'm asking why is there surprise when some people were turned off by that?


I wouldn't call Gary all that critical of the Mets. He tends to have players he likes/dislikes over the years and he beats certain topics to death with the players he doesn't like....but I wouldn't really consider him some incredibly honest all-knowing source. That's not to say I think he and David were wrong in their points....I think the were correct and that the anonymous sniping was ridiculous.

I didn't like the article, but I didn't take issue with Carig writing what people were telling him. I agree I don't think the gripes in that article "he didnt say hi to me" were really much to be griping about.......and I don't think many players or anyone in the FO really have much room to gripe given how poorly they did their own jobs.
I think it makes the Mets look bad much moreso than it makes Collins look bad.

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