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?
Poll ended at Sat Dec 30, 2017 3:31 pm
Wuilmer Becerra (OF) 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Jeff McNeil (UTIL) 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Ali Sanchez (C) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Quinn Brodey (OF) 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Jacob Rhame (RHP) 27%  27%  [ 4 ]
Jayce Boyd (1B) 7%  7%  [ 1 ]
Austin McGeorge (RHP) 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Matt Pobereyko (RHP) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Matt Winaker (1b) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Gregory Guerrero (SS) 13%  13%  [ 2 ]
Total votes : 15
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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 3:33 am 
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LTKfRGM wrote:
Minor point, but Rhame was already on the 40. The Dodgers had him on the 40 all year. That's actually a bit of a knock on him, being on the 40 but not earning even a minute of MLB time with LA.

But also, that was a good team with both a strong roster and a well regarded farm system, and they thought he was worth protecting. I'm not sure how much his stock has changed from a year ago.

And he was ranking somewhere near the end of their top 30. BA had him #31 coming into the year, and said at the trade time that he had "improved many elements of his performance in 2017". Sickles had him in their top 30 and graded a C+. Callis at mlb.com had him at #28 in their system at the time of the trade.

He's not the most thrilling guy, but I think it's a safe bet he belongs on our list somewhere.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:20 am 
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That Quinn Brodey pick was soooooo bad.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:45 pm 
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acerimusdux wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
I didn't try to make such a correlation. I said the others 'wouldn't look any better' [than Rhame] right now bc they are mostly less exposed/experienced arms.


I only thought you were implying that they might look better after more experience or exposure.

But I am saying I don't think they have more a chance to improve than Rhame. The recent draftees have more time, but also farther to go to get there. If their ceilings are all pen arms, I don't really see more to dream on there.

I don't think inexperience = higher ceiling. I said it's unclear that the other RPers have higher ceilings but that there is still reason to dream a little on others.

Otoh, Rhame has been more or less exposed. He might have reached the show, but like many others before him, it doesn't appear he has the goods to succeed. He lacks movement, command, deception and presence. Yes, velocity is something but it's a commodity that is becoming pretty common these days. Even though it was a small sample (45 BF), he got tattooed (19 batters reached). Even if you get past the results, he just looked totally overmatched. He just doesn't appear to be ahead of a guy like McGowan, who despite the 2+ mph difference, looks to be a pretty similar pitcher.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 12:59 pm 
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Ralf wrote:
That Quinn Brodey pick was soooooo bad.


Why?

Mostly college guys don't hit in Brooklyn. Among players who got regular ABs he was 3rd in the team in slugging, tops among college draftees. He was also 3rd in stolen bases. His 21.9% K rate was higher than I'd like but not awful. I think he's very much a wait and see how he looks next year guy. Didn't wow anyone, but didn't hurt his ranking either.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 1:17 am 
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I nominate Cameron Planck for a spot and will probably shift my attention towards him once McNeil is off the list.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:29 am 
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Hot Takes wrote:
I nominate Cameron Planck for a spot and will probably shift my attention towards him once McNeil is off the list.


He's a good one. I forgot about him.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:10 am 
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Just realized Dimino hasn't been nominated.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:15 am 
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acerimusdux wrote:
LTKfRGM wrote:
Minor point, but Rhame was already on the 40. The Dodgers had him on the 40 all year. That's actually a bit of a knock on him, being on the 40 but not earning even a minute of MLB time with LA.

But also, that was a good team with both a strong roster and a well regarded farm system, and they thought he was worth protecting. I'm not sure how much his stock has changed from a year ago.

And he was ranking somewhere near the end of their top 30. BA had him #31 coming into the year, and said at the trade time that he had "improved many elements of his performance in 2017". Sickles had him in their top 30 and graded a C+. Callis at mlb.com had him at #28 in their system at the time of the trade.

He's not the most thrilling guy, but I think it's a safe bet he belongs on our list somewhere.


Not trying to crap on Rhame, because he's at least someone with big PCL success which may make him the most successful from that great firesale last year, but I see him consistently referred to as a "big arm."

Given where velocity is at these days, isn't his arm essentially the baseline average arm strength from the right side of a bullpen arm in today's game?

His average fastball was 95.1 The MLB average for ALL relievers was 94.4, and if I knew how to filter out RHRP from LHRP, I'm going to guess the RHRP was right around that 95 mark.

So he has essentially average bullpen arm velocity, what appears to be little movement or deception, and no workable secondary pitch right now. Of course there's time for any of the above to change, and having the 95 gets you a seat at the table that he wouldn't get if he was more 92 or 93 ala Kevin McGowan, but still.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:17 am 
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LTKfRGM wrote:
Hot Takes wrote:
I nominate Cameron Planck for a spot and will probably shift my attention towards him once McNeil is off the list.


He's a good one. I forgot about him.


He hasn't even stepped on a mound as a Met yet, has he?


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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:32 am 
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MarkJohnson>You wrote:
LTKfRGM wrote:
Hot Takes wrote:
I nominate Cameron Planck for a spot and will probably shift my attention towards him once McNeil is off the list.


He's a good one. I forgot about him.


He hasn't even stepped on a mound as a Met yet, has he?

Nope. Yeah, I don't know what the votes would be for even in this range.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:33 am 
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Ralf wrote:
That Quinn Brodey pick was soooooo bad.


I don't think the amount of out-and-out wasted picks in the early rounds gets nearly enough attention here.

We talk a lot about the Gavin Cecchini whiff or the Brandon Nimmo reach, but a huge issue re: where we are in terms of no farm system to promote from or trade from comes from the fact that we don't even produce somewhat exciting "role player" types from the middle rounds.

Criticize the previous regime's love of reaching for relievers, but they got guys like Daniel Murphy, Lucas Duda, Jacob DeGrom, Kirk Niewenhuis, Josh Edgin, Dillon Gee, Jon Niese, Josh Thole, Bobby Parnell, Goeddel, den Dekker -- various degrees of success there, but these are basically throwaway rounds to the current regime and guys like that contributed to winning teams and/or were dealt for guys that did.

Our best examples of these types recently are like Plawecki and Reynolds - who were a 1(c) and 2nd round pick respectively - thats too high to be only getting that quality of player, and then nothing after. There's just nothing coming in year after year to even help fill out the minors' rosters and get lucky with some of these types.

Guys drafted in 2014 in those middle rounds should be starting to make some noise at the top of our system. Instead, here's what we got:

-Milton Ramos (terrible, dumped for int'l pool $)
-Eudor Garcia (released out of A ball)
-Josh Prevost (???)
-Tyler Moore (believe he has been released and resigned a few times to be a 3rd catcher)
-Brad Wieck (somewhat interesting, traded for Alex Torres who lasted 3 months here)
-Dash Winningham (looks likely to spend his career in Columbia)]
-Michael Katz (lasted 1 season)
-Kelly Secrest (mediocre AA reliever)

Thats rounds 3-10. You should get something there. Just a complete waste.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is #36?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2018 11:50 am 
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MarkJohnson>You wrote:
Ralf wrote:
That Quinn Brodey pick was soooooo bad.


I don't think the amount of out-and-out wasted picks in the early rounds gets nearly enough attention here.

We talk a lot about the Gavin Cecchini whiff or the Brandon Nimmo reach, but a huge issue re: where we are in terms of no farm system to promote from or trade from comes from the fact that we don't even produce somewhat exciting "role player" types from the middle rounds.

Criticize the previous regime's love of reaching for relievers, but they got guys like Daniel Murphy, Lucas Duda, Jacob DeGrom, Kirk Niewenhuis, Josh Edgin, Dillon Gee, Jon Niese, Josh Thole, Bobby Parnell, Goeddel, den Dekker -- various degrees of success there, but these are basically throwaway rounds to the current regime and guys like that contributed to winning teams and/or were dealt for guys that did.

Our best examples of these types recently are like Plawecki and Reynolds - who were a 1(c) and 2nd round pick respectively - thats too high to be only getting that quality of player, and then nothing after. There's just nothing coming in year after year to even help fill out the minors' rosters and get lucky with some of these types.

Guys drafted in 2014 in those middle rounds should be starting to make some noise at the top of our system. Instead, here's what we got:

-Milton Ramos (terrible, dumped for int'l pool $)
-Eudor Garcia (released out of A ball)
-Josh Prevost (???)
-Tyler Moore (believe he has been released and resigned a few times to be a 3rd catcher)
-Brad Wieck (somewhat interesting, traded for Alex Torres who lasted 3 months here)
-Dash Winningham (looks likely to spend his career in Columbia)]
-Michael Katz (lasted 1 season)
-Kelly Secrest (mediocre AA reliever)

Thats rounds 3-10. You should get something there. Just a complete waste.


Completely agree. It often appears as though their strategy is to grab guys way earlier then they would typically have gone on most boards. I'd be fine with that if they had quality scouting but frankly, the scouting in this organization is awful.

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