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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:21 am 
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metswillkillyoursoul wrote:
dragonfly wrote:
About to drop to 4-18 in the last 22. When was the last time they've had a stretch this bad? This is early the low point of the last 10 years, maybe 15.


2004 I'd guess. When they quit under Howe much like they have quit under Callaway. Howe was a bit more of an intelligent baseball guy than Callaway though, just no personality.


You're probably right. There is no doubt they need to blow this thing up. What needs to happen next is the GM being fired and the new GM being allowed to come in and pick his new manager and staff. I don't want this front office trying to maneuver around a rebuild.


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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:23 am 
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dragonfly wrote:
I really don't want to get on Nimmo, who is literally the only reason to watch this team when deGrom isn't pitching, but I wish he was just a little less selective. I know he's trying to get on base in the 9th, but to take 3 straight pitches after being ahead 3-0 only to strike out? Had another AB tonight where he seemed to be working a count and passed on a couple of juicy pitches a guy with his developing power should be driving.

Just an observation.


The first two strikes he couldn't do much with and the third "strike" was comfortably low. Take a look at it's location on Gameday.

I generally agree with your point, but in this situation a walk means as much as a homer.


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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:27 am 
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sluger11787 wrote:
dragonfly wrote:
I really don't want to get on Nimmo, who is literally the only reason to watch this team when deGrom isn't pitching, but I wish he was just a little less selective. I know he's trying to get on base in the 9th, but to take 3 straight pitches after being ahead 3-0 only to strike out? Had another AB tonight where he seemed to be working a count and passed on a couple of juicy pitches a guy with his developing power should be driving.

Just an observation.


The first two strikes he couldn't do much with and the third "strike" was comfortably low. Take a look at it's location on Gameday.

I generally agree with your point, but in this situation a walk means as much as a homer.


Yeah it might not be the best example to use that last AB, but I've noticed this recently with his approach - seems like he's passing on many good pitches with a deep count in the back of his mind. If he maintains a .400+ OBA who am I to argue his approach. Just wish he'd look for more hits because he has a pretty good shot of getting 2, 3 or 4 bases out of a swing, than 1 with a walk.


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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:28 am 
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dragonfly wrote:
metswillkillyoursoul wrote:
dragonfly wrote:
About to drop to 4-18 in the last 22. When was the last time they've had a stretch this bad? This is early the low point of the last 10 years, maybe 15.


2004 I'd guess. When they quit under Howe much like they have quit under Callaway. Howe was a bit more of an intelligent baseball guy than Callaway though, just no personality.


You're probably right. There is no doubt they need to blow this thing up. What needs to happen next is the GM being fired and the new GM being allowed to come in and pick his new manager and staff. I don't want this front office trying to maneuver around a rebuild.


Yea they definitely don't deserve to have their fingerprints on a rebuild. Just so many puzzling moves and poor evaluations of talent (that have gone on to success with other franchises) as well as poor judgement in signing players and just a glacial, no urgency approach.

A clean sweep of these clowns is needed. New GM needs to be at his desk Monday morning. Mickey Kotiteway needs to go yesterday. It won't happen because we're incompetent but it would be nice if somebody in that organization had some real rage and anger over what's happening now. Big big changes are needed. A season over i


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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:31 am 
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dragonfly wrote:
I really don't want to get on Nimmo, who is literally the only reason to watch this team when deGrom isn't pitching, but I wish he was just a little less selective. I know he's trying to get on base in the 9th, but to take 3 straight pitches after being ahead 3-0 only to strike out? Had another AB tonight where he seemed to be working a count and passed on a couple of juicy pitches a guy with his developing power should be driving.

Just an observation.


After a game where a Braves starter on a pitch count threw about 70 pitches in 7 innings I'm pretty sure this isn't a good take.


8)

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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:32 am 
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metswillkillyoursoul wrote:
Yea they definitely don't deserve to have their fingerprints on a rebuild. Just so many puzzling moves and poor evaluations of talent (that have gone on to success with other franchises) as well as poor judgement in signing players and just a glacial, no urgency approach.

A clean sweep of these clowns is needed. New GM needs to be at his desk Monday morning. Mickey Kotiteway needs to go yesterday. It won't happen because we're incompetent but it would be nice if somebody in that organization had some real rage and anger over what's happening now. Big big changes are needed. A season over i



Your hate of Mickey Callaway is something serious, my lord.

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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:42 am 
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MetsWhiz93 wrote:
metswillkillyoursoul wrote:
Yea they definitely don't deserve to have their fingerprints on a rebuild. Just so many puzzling moves and poor evaluations of talent (that have gone on to success with other franchises) as well as poor judgement in signing players and just a glacial, no urgency approach.

A clean sweep of these clowns is needed. New GM needs to be at his desk Monday morning. Mickey Kotiteway needs to go yesterday. It won't happen because we're incompetent but it would be nice if somebody in that organization had some real rage and anger over what's happening now. Big big changes are needed. A season over i



Your hate of Mickey Callaway is something serious, my lord.


Dumbest Mets manager I've ever seen. Also the first time I've seen the Mets quit on a manager less than 70 games into year 1. It's all very much justified when you preside over such an unprecedented, historically hideous stretch like this.

This is Trottier with the Rangers, John MacLean with the Devils. You pull the plug right now and pretend he was never there


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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:45 am 
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I'm not sure what you do, because I think they're more inclined to be dumb and try to fix it rather than to be smart and tear it down.

You need your young players to flip the switch and play better, and you need your old players to play well enough to fool other teams into wanting them.

Mickey certainly hasn't helped himself, but I don't know what Whitey Herzog would do with this roster.

Sandy absolutely needs to go, but I don't know what the point would be if you just move everyone else up a chair.


8)

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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:49 am 
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R Nitelight wrote:
I'm not sure what you do, because I think they're more inclined to be dumb and try to fix it rather than to be smart and tear it down.

You need your young players to flip the switch and play better, and you need your old players to play well enough to fool other teams into wanting them.

Mickey certainly hasn't helped himself, but I don't know what Whitey Herzog would do with this roster.

Sandy absolutely needs to go, but I don't know what the point would be if you just move everyone else up a chair.


8)


He would have them at .500 or better. Because talent wise it's not nearly as bad a team as they appear to be record wise They're just...not playing baseball right now. They're just mentally drained and without any sort of leadership or direction.


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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 5:04 am 
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8)

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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:15 am 
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R Nitelight wrote:
I'm not sure what you do, because I think they're more inclined to be dumb and try to fix it rather than to be smart and tear it down.

You need your young players to flip the switch and play better, and you need your old players to play well enough to fool other teams into wanting them.

Mickey certainly hasn't helped himself, but I don't know what Whitey Herzog would do with this roster.

Sandy absolutely needs to go, but I don't know what the point would be if you just move everyone else up a chair.


8)


By tear it down, do you include deGrom and Thor. Because that is not something I would do. Is assume you don't mean Nimmo, Conforto, Rosario and Smith.

And Bruce/Cespedes are not remotely movable.

So a teardown basically means AsCab, Familia, Blevins, Wherler, Matz.

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 Post subject: Re: IGT 6/14/2018 Mets vs D'Backs Former Met vs Vargas
PostPosted: Fri Jun 15, 2018 7:22 am 
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I’m not in favor of trading Thor or deGrom because I definitely subscribe to the “Baseball is entertainment”! Theory and I can be entertained without winning s championship (and without those 2 there’s just nothing entertaining here).

But I would wager a gentleman/ladies bet that the next good Mets team doesn’t happen until well after deGrom has signed his big FA contract elsewhere (Philly?).


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