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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Fri Dec 06, 2013 11:56 am 
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MarkJohnson>You wrote:
I doubt there is anyone not wearing orange and blue who would call Pierce and MWP a toss-up. I mean, thats like absurd.

Ditto Bargnani and KG.

You wanna argue Udrih vs. Terry I guess thats a debate, but its fairly inconsequential insofar as the successes of each franchise. I definitely don't agree with the definitive statement you conclude on, but THATS at least a toss-up.

I mean, come on re: Bargnani being the best of the lot: basketball-reference attempts to quantify win-shares much like WAR for baseball.

Bargnani, FOR HIS CAREER, has 16.3 win shares. He was worth 0.1 win shares last year. Has never had more than 4.2 in a season.

Even as they get older, Garnett and Pierce, over the last 5 years together don't have a single season under 5.6 win shares.


8)

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Bargnani, a 7-footer from Italy known for his shooting rather than his tough play or fighting skill, was clearly the aggressor. A few minutes later, his trash-talking of Garnett after a 3-pointer was enough for Referee Joey Crawford to issue him a second technical foul, ending his night early. Bargnani was treated to a standing ovation by his teammates as he walked off the court.

Surprisingly, Garnett, often the instigator throughout his career, seemed less intense than Bargnani, who seemed to get in Garnett’s head.

For long stretches of the game, he seemed every bit as much of a problem as any of the team’s emergency fill-ins, struggling to guard Bargnani and Amar’e Stoudemire, players he has dominated before in his career.

Once a defensive stalwart in Minnesota and Boston, the 37-year-old Garnett, a veteran of 19 seasons, has begun to show his age. Coming into the game, his defensive rating of 103 points allowed per 100 possessions was the worst he had recorded since he was 21. Offensively, things have been little better; his 11.1 player efficiency rating is less than half of what he was capable of during his prime.


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/06/sport ... .html?_r=0

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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 11:44 am 
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metswiki wrote:
MarkJohnson>You wrote:
I doubt there is anyone not wearing orange and blue who would call Pierce and MWP a toss-up. I mean, thats like absurd.

Ditto Bargnani and KG.

You wanna argue Udrih vs. Terry I guess thats a debate, but its fairly inconsequential insofar as the successes of each franchise. I definitely don't agree with the definitive statement you conclude on, but THATS at least a toss-up.

I mean, come on re: Bargnani being the best of the lot: basketball-reference attempts to quantify win-shares much like WAR for baseball.

Bargnani, FOR HIS CAREER, has 16.3 win shares. He was worth 0.1 win shares last year. Has never had more than 4.2 in a season.

Even as they get older, Garnett and Pierce, over the last 5 years together don't have a single season under 5.6 win shares.


8)

Quote:
Bargnani, a 7-footer from Italy known for his shooting rather than his tough play or fighting skill, was clearly the aggressor. A few minutes later, his trash-talking of Garnett after a 3-pointer was enough for Referee Joey Crawford to issue him a second technical foul, ending his night early. Bargnani was treated to a standing ovation by his teammates as he walked off the court.

Surprisingly, Garnett, often the instigator throughout his career, seemed less intense than Bargnani, who seemed to get in Garnett’s head.

For long stretches of the game, he seemed every bit as much of a problem as any of the team’s emergency fill-ins, struggling to guard Bargnani and Amar’e Stoudemire, players he has dominated before in his career.

Once a defensive stalwart in Minnesota and Boston, the 37-year-old Garnett, a veteran of 19 seasons, has begun to show his age. Coming into the game, his defensive rating of 103 points allowed per 100 possessions was the worst he had recorded since he was 21. Offensively, things have been little better; his 11.1 player efficiency rating is less than half of what he was capable of during his prime.


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/06/sport ... .html?_r=0



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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 4:29 pm 
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:lol: yup. worst play ever. I have no defense...like a Bargnani.

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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 5:22 pm 
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:). Hey, at least they won. They are precious few between the teams these days.

Aldrich's reaction might be my favorite. Everyone else is incredulous, he looks almost hopeful, as if to say, "I'll gladly take your rotation spot now, please."


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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Thu Dec 19, 2013 8:19 pm 
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Bargnani is nicknamed "Il Mago", which translates to "The Magician", for his ability to disappear completely on defense.

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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 3:53 pm 
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MikeH wrote:
Bargnani is nicknamed "Il Mago", which translates to "The Magician", for his ability to disappear completely on defense.



And what was lost in the previous game's fiasco is that his inability to help on penetration allowed for one of the easiest game winning lay-ups you'll ever see.

I will say his one on one post defense has been pretty solid though.

I remember Raptors fans saying a few years back that he needs someone to punch him in the face before every quarter to get his competitiveness up and that he plays better when mad.

I LOL'd at the time but now that I'm watching him regularly I think I agree. Maybe Metta should lay him out every time he's about to walk on the court.

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MarkJohnson>You wrote:

Yeah, and if you're using the "He's 19" logic, then I guess the best report a scout could give us is:


"I have no idea. He's a teenager. He may go through 5 arm surgeries between now and his 30th birthday. He may add a pitch. He may lose a pitch. He may put on 30 lbs and add velocity. He may put on 50 lbs and eat his way out of the league. I literally have no idea what he is going to be."

But thats not what these guys are paid to do, nor what we are looking for them to do, right?


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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 4:53 pm 
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Speaking of Metta, he also has a big part in making that .gif great.

His quiet resignation is pretty fantastic.


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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2014 11:17 am 
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MarkJohnson>You wrote:
metswiki wrote:
MarkJohnson>You wrote:
I doubt there is anyone not wearing orange and blue who would call Pierce and MWP a toss-up. I mean, thats like absurd.

Ditto Bargnani and KG.

You wanna argue Udrih vs. Terry I guess thats a debate, but its fairly inconsequential insofar as the successes of each franchise. I definitely don't agree with the definitive statement you conclude on, but THATS at least a toss-up.

I mean, come on re: Bargnani being the best of the lot: basketball-reference attempts to quantify win-shares much like WAR for baseball.

Bargnani, FOR HIS CAREER, has 16.3 win shares. He was worth 0.1 win shares last year. Has never had more than 4.2 in a season.

Even as they get older, Garnett and Pierce, over the last 5 years together don't have a single season under 5.6 win shares.


8)

Quote:
Bargnani, a 7-footer from Italy known for his shooting rather than his tough play or fighting skill, was clearly the aggressor. A few minutes later, his trash-talking of Garnett after a 3-pointer was enough for Referee Joey Crawford to issue him a second technical foul, ending his night early. Bargnani was treated to a standing ovation by his teammates as he walked off the court.

Surprisingly, Garnett, often the instigator throughout his career, seemed less intense than Bargnani, who seemed to get in Garnett’s head.

For long stretches of the game, he seemed every bit as much of a problem as any of the team’s emergency fill-ins, struggling to guard Bargnani and Amar’e Stoudemire, players he has dominated before in his career.

Once a defensive stalwart in Minnesota and Boston, the 37-year-old Garnett, a veteran of 19 seasons, has begun to show his age. Coming into the game, his defensive rating of 103 points allowed per 100 possessions was the worst he had recorded since he was 21. Offensively, things have been little better; his 11.1 player efficiency rating is less than half of what he was capable of during his prime.


http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/06/sport ... .html?_r=0



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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Fri Feb 07, 2014 5:26 pm 
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hysterical now that anyone thought the Knicks would be a better team than the Nets. Not that it's saying all that much, but the Nets seem to be on their way to the 3rd or 4th seed in the East conf. Despite looking horrendous the 2 months of the season, they have taken it to a different level now. I don't watch all that much NBA but it always seems to be an issue of getting opportunities for many guys. The Nets finally relented and are giving PT to a few guys that have really responded - Teletovic primarily, Kirilenko is finally healthy and he is phenomenal, Livingston, and Alan Anderson. Garnett has often looked like a shell of his former self however. But Pierce can still add some value and Deron Williams and Joe Johnson is having a terrific season. That's 8 solid deep. Imagine if Lopez had stayed healthy...


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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 6:52 pm 
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HeyNowHK wrote:
hysterical now that anyone thought the Knicks would be a better team than the Nets.


Why is that hysterical?

A) The Nets have 2 more wins than the Knicks right now
B) The Knicks won 54 games last season; the Nets aren't even .500 right now


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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Sat Feb 08, 2014 8:51 pm 
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thebull wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
hysterical now that anyone thought the Knicks would be a better team than the Nets.


Why is that hysterical?

A) The Nets have 2 more wins than the Knicks right now
B) The Knicks won 54 games last season; the Nets aren't even .500 right now

The teams appear to be going in different directions. And the Nets have been playing with their best player out for the season.


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 Post subject: Re: Knicks-Nets rivalry
PostPosted: Sun Feb 09, 2014 9:52 pm 
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HeyNowHK wrote:
thebull wrote:
HeyNowHK wrote:
hysterical now that anyone thought the Knicks would be a better team than the Nets.


Why is that hysterical?

A) The Nets have 2 more wins than the Knicks right now
B) The Knicks won 54 games last season; the Nets aren't even .500 right now

The teams appear to be going in different directions. And the Nets have been playing with their best player out for the season.


Again, why is it hysterical to have thought the Knicks would be better? There was no reason to think the Knicks would be awful.


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