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?
Poll ended at Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:59 am
Phil Evans (Util) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Mark Vientos (SS/3B) 54%  54%  [ 13 ]
Anthony Kay (LHP) 4%  4%  [ 1 ]
Chris Flexen (RHP) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Tomas Nido (C) 8%  8%  [ 2 ]
Peter Alonso (1b) 25%  25%  [ 6 ]
Justin Dunn (RHP) 4%  4%  [ 1 ]
Thomas Szapucki (LHP) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Desmond Lindsay (OF) 0%  0%  [ 0 ]
Luis Guillorme (SS) 4%  4%  [ 1 ]
Total votes : 24
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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 5:38 pm 
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Just for the record I don’t disagree with your rationale or what you are saying. Just crazy the system has fallen to this point

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 5:41 pm 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Just for the record I don’t disagree with your rationale or what you are saying. Just crazy the system has fallen to this point

Yeah it sucks.

I nominate Bashlor as the next guy to be added to the poll. I might pull the trigger on him pretty early.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 6:06 pm 
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Bashlor nomination noted. One of the prospect writers (can’t remember who) called him one of the best RP prospects in baseball

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:01 am 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Which of those Mets names are "impressive"? Gsellman had an awful year to the point we don't know what he is. Rosario is inarguably a top prospect, Smith looked horrid, we shall see. The rest are all filler or "if they somehow are healthy maybe they can be good" like Matz/Lugo etc, Nimmo looks "solid". That's a very unimpressive group to be citing why the farm system is horrendous. Forget the Yankees for a second, the Mets have an AWFUL farm system AND had an awful year. The Mets have had unusual high level promotions that other teams haven't experienced? How can they both be horrible in the bigs but also have tons of "impressive" promotions? And "trading away"... Michael Fulmer is the only "big" prospect the Mets have traded in recent history. This idea they "went for it" and didn't come through just isn't based in reality. Had they kept Fulmer almost no chance Cespedes is here. Who are these other prospects they traded away? Dilson Herrera who has been awful and injured? If anything it's unbelievable how few prospects they have traded and picks they have lost to be in such dire straits.


Yeah, that list just served to depress me. I do not see anything impressive about it.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 9:08 am 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Definition of famously

1 :in a celebrated manner
2 :in a superlative fashion
3 :to an unusual degree :very
4 : HeyNowHK knows about it


:lol: That's awesome.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:24 am 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Which of those Mets names are "impressive"? Gsellman had an awful year to the point we don't know what he is. Rosario is inarguably a top prospect, Smith looked horrid, we shall see. The rest are all filler or "if they somehow are healthy maybe they can be good" like Matz/Lugo etc, Nimmo looks "solid". That's a very unimpressive group to be citing why the farm system is horrendous. Forget the Yankees for a second, the Mets have an AWFUL farm system AND had an awful year. The Mets have had unusual high level promotions that other teams haven't experienced? How can they both be horrible in the bigs but also have tons of "impressive" promotions? And "trading away"... Michael Fulmer is the only "big" prospect the Mets have traded in recent history. This idea they "went for it" and didn't come through just isn't based in reality. Had they kept Fulmer almost no chance Cespedes is here. Who are these other prospects they traded away? Dilson Herrera who has been awful and injured? If anything it's unbelievable how few prospects they have traded and picks they have lost to be in such dire straits.


Impressive to me is a solid major leaguer or better. To me, that includes:

Matz
Lugo
Dario Alvarez (traded)
Gsellman still has a shot
Ynoa (traded)
Rosario
Dom Smith
Nimmo
TJ Rivera
Flexen maybe in the bullpen?
Sewald

All of those names helped to increase the stock of our collective farm system. Now they are all gone in a two year period. I'm simply pointing out that and some trades (of guys who were ranked well - not necessarily stars) have helped lower the system's strength. I've not argued that our system is strong or that the front office has done a fine job filling it back up. But it does take a while to revamp a system unless you want to trade deGrom and Noah.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:40 am 
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yalikeMetroplitans wrote:


Impressive to me is a solid major leaguer or better. To me, that includes:

Matz
Lugo
Dario Alvarez (traded)
Gsellman still has a shot
Ynoa (traded)
Rosario
Dom Smith
Nimmo
TJ Rivera
Flexen maybe in the bullpen?
Sewald

All of those names helped to increase the stock of our collective farm system. Now they are all gone in a two year period. I'm simply pointing out that and some trades (of guys who were ranked well - not necessarily stars) have helped lower the system's strength. I've not argued that our system is strong or that the front office has done a fine job filling it back up. But it does take a while to revamp a system unless you want to trade deGrom and Noah.


Just out of curiosity, have you seen Dario Alvarez' WHIP this year?

The jury's still out on a few of those and I'm not sure that a guy like Lugo or Flexen or TJ or even all 3, changes our overall prospect situation very much. Dom & Rosario, however, obviously do.

The mets had bad luck with their prospects this year. Outside of Gimenez & Alonso and Humphreys if you want to include him, none of the top prospects stepped up. It was the opposite last year when several guys stepped up. (Dom, Rosario, Cecchini, Szapucki, Lindsay and Dunn hadn't taken a step back yet).

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:49 am 
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Dario Alvarez? He has a 5.10 career FIP, 5.06 ERA he's absolutely awful.

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:51 am 
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My lasting memory of Dario Alvarez was watching Dee Gordon hit an absolute bomb off him in September 2015. Had great seats through a work contact right behind home plate in those nice cushy chairs. My mind was pretty much set after that.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 10:56 am 
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Metro2007 wrote:
Dario Alvarez? He has a 5.10 career FIP, 5.06 ERA he's absolutely awful.


So I got one guy wrong. He had a nice ERA this year in Texas! :D

Anyway, my point is, most of those guys buoyed our system and they've not filled it back in, yet. You can argue they should have picked better in the draft, spent more internationally, traded better (though it was a terrible market to be a seller this year), but I'm simply pointing out they've graduated or traded a lot of guys the last two years.


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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:03 am 
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yalikeMetroplitans wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
Dario Alvarez? He has a 5.10 career FIP, 5.06 ERA he's absolutely awful.


So I got one guy wrong. He had a nice ERA this year in Texas! :D

Anyway, my point is, most of those guys buoyed our system and they've not filled it back in, yet. You can argue they should have picked better in the draft, spent more internationally, traded better (though it was a terrible market to be a seller this year), but I'm simply pointing out they've graduated or traded a lot of guys the last two years.



But there have been drafts since dealing guys like Alvarez and yet the system is close to totally barren. Even the "top" prospects on this list are based in large part due to where they were selected in the draft. Dunn? Lindsay? Kay? They have done nothing or close to nothing. Even Peterson? What has he done? Vientos? They have added 40 players via 2016 draft, 40 players via 2017 draft etc etc and this is where we stand. It's a really poor job of drafting, player development coming home to roost far more than simply explaining it away with trades/promotions. Matt Harvey came up going on 6 years ago, DeGrom 5. Forget developing a rare talent like DeGrom or Thor... where is the Mets-era Murphy? Where is even a Duda? There is close to 0 help on the way in 2018 (on paper) so yet it's not as if "well 2017 was a down year but 2018 we should have a lot of talent close to ready".

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 Post subject: Re: Who is the #3 prospect in the Mets system?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2017 11:07 am 
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Metro2007 wrote:
yalikeMetroplitans wrote:
Metro2007 wrote:
Dario Alvarez? He has a 5.10 career FIP, 5.06 ERA he's absolutely awful.


So I got one guy wrong. He had a nice ERA this year in Texas! :D

Anyway, my point is, most of those guys buoyed our system and they've not filled it back in, yet. You can argue they should have picked better in the draft, spent more internationally, traded better (though it was a terrible market to be a seller this year), but I'm simply pointing out they've graduated or traded a lot of guys the last two years.



But there have been drafts since dealing guys like Alvarez and yet the system is close to totally barren. Even the "top" prospects on this list are based in large part due to where they were selected in the draft. Dunn? Lindsay? Kay? They have done nothing or close to nothing. Even Peterson? What has he done? Vientos? They have added 40 players via 2016 draft, 40 players via 2017 draft etc etc and this is where we stand. It's a really poor job of drafting, player development coming home to roost far more than simply explaining it away with trades/promotions. Matt Harvey came up going on 6 years ago, DeGrom 5. Forget developing a rare talent like DeGrom or Thor... where is the Mets-era Murphy? Where is even a Duda? There is close to 0 help on the way in 2018 (on paper) so yet it's not as if "well 2017 was a down year but 2018 we should have a lot of talent close to ready".


Not sure I've said anything that disagrees with any of this.


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