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 Post subject: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 5:58 pm 
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Multiple individuals connected to the team have indicated Mets patriarch Fred Wilpon, 81, is unlikely to hand the organization’s reins to a young, purely analytics-driven GM with whom he would perhaps have difficulty connecting. The growing belief is Wilpon will look toward a more traditional baseball person . . . There is thought among team officials that perhaps the Mets became too analytics driven in recent seasons under Sandy Alderson’s watch, and a veteran leader with a pure baseball background would help shift the organization toward the center.


https://www.yahoo.com/sports/wilpons-th ... 59811.html

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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 6:21 pm 
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The best organizations incorporate both. Using only all of one or the other (analytics or gut) is professional suicide.


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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 8:58 am 
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No one would accuse the Mets of using too much analytics. Only the clueless Ponzis would interpret their failure the last 3 years as a result of that. Literally talking out of their backsides as usual


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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 9:53 am 
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AllWrightNow wrote:
The best organizations incorporate both. Using only all of one or the other (analytics or gut) is professional suicide.


I'm far from an expert, and while having a character guy on the roster, like Wright or Grandy isn't usually measured by analytics, I think going 96% analytics, 4% character and 0% guts is a perfectly valid approach and not professional suicide at all.

Can anyone give good examples of guts or old fashioned baseball actually working? It's fun, but analytics is actually effective. Big difference. (IMHO) - as I said, I'm not an expert.

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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:05 am 
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LTKfRGM wrote:
AllWrightNow wrote:
The best organizations incorporate both. Using only all of one or the other (analytics or gut) is professional suicide.


I'm far from an expert, and while having a character guy on the roster, like Wright or Grandy isn't usually measured by analytics, I think going 96% analytics, 4% character and 0% guts is a perfectly valid approach and not professional suicide at all.

Can anyone give good examples of guts or old fashioned baseball actually working? It's fun, but analytics is actually effective. Big difference. (IMHO) - as I said, I'm not an expert.


While analytics should govern the overall analysis of players. You need to allow manager to go by guts to some extent in game. Analytics can’t tell you on that day which guy looks under the weather or which opposing pitcher doesn’t have that usually good pitch that can affect the PH you use, etc


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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:12 am 
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The only analytics Fred cares about is "bottom line", let's not kid ourselves. Probably looking to lay off some stat guys.


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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 11:37 am 
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Is "gut" the new word for scouting?


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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:15 pm 
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It depends on what you are talking about

There are no purely analytical determination in whether you should or shouldn’t give a 16 year old Dominican kid a million dollars.

Pure Analytics is foolish in determining high school talent - You are not going to sign a HS kid with an 80mph fastball just because he has a 15k rate in some small town in Oklahoma.

Even in college and the minors you want to have a 50/50 mixture of scouting and stats in determining value.

If you went with pure stats you would have been justified in calling Justin Dunn close to a non-prospect last season.

Even in the majors is the stats going to tell you if a guy who put up bad numbers before undergoing TJS is worth signing because he was great 2 years ago?

Was it stats or scouting that would have predicted a pitcher like Wheeler would be blossoming into a great starter now?

There are so many factors that are simply impossible to quantify through statistics .... especially when it comes to evaluating young talent with no track record.


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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:21 pm 
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How many analytical guys do you need?

Isn't it just analyzing data?

Shouldn't quality be prioritized over quantity?


8)

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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 1:37 pm 
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R Nitelight wrote:
How many analytical guys do you need?

Isn't it just analyzing data?

Shouldn't quality be prioritized over quantity?


8)


Personally I think the Mets are too Wilpon heavy throughout the organization.

But I would think if you are going to do it right you would need a good number of analytical guys in the organization. They aren't just analyzing major league numbers but I assume every college and high school player in the country.


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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:13 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: The Wilpons think the Mets are "too analytics-heavy"
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2018 3:51 pm 
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TomInNC wrote:
LTKfRGM wrote:
AllWrightNow wrote:
The best organizations incorporate both. Using only all of one or the other (analytics or gut) is professional suicide.


I'm far from an expert, and while having a character guy on the roster, like Wright or Grandy isn't usually measured by analytics, I think going 96% analytics, 4% character and 0% guts is a perfectly valid approach and not professional suicide at all.

Can anyone give good examples of guts or old fashioned baseball actually working? It's fun, but analytics is actually effective. Big difference. (IMHO) - as I said, I'm not an expert.


While analytics should govern the overall analysis of players. You need to allow manager to go by guts to some extent in game. Analytics can’t tell you on that day which guy looks under the weather or which opposing pitcher doesn’t have that usually good pitch that can affect the PH you use, etc


Game time decisions, fine. Team building, I'd go with Analytics.

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